MSE Modern and LackeyCCG Discussion [Download in Original Post]

Login or register to post comments
continued...
Sun, 2015-11-15 21:04
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

I believe I did as K15, yep

Sun, 2015-11-15 21:10
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

Actually, Wind, can we get on the chat and discuss balancing?

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Tue, 2015-11-17 15:08
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

Of note, Theria isn't legal in MSE Modern. VEB block is like a sleeper agent that gives people false decks
(that and two copies of Phylenia Canopy aren't likely to activate Deja Vu )

Tue, 2015-11-17 15:23
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

Hey, uh, Herzi? Does your copy decklist say that Basic Mountain copies a forest?
Hey, Fluffy, just make a quick check over the sets in your deck, make sure none of them say VEB, Repel, Storm, or GVM. I saw something I think is from Repel

Tue, 2015-11-17 16:16
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

That looks fun. Wanna have a go, Fluffy?

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Tue, 2015-11-17 16:48
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

I don't see it. You need to load the custommagic plugin, I think.

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Tue, 2015-11-17 16:54
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

Could you send me a whisper in the chat?

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Tue, 2015-11-17 16:58
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

Hosted and toasted. (Is that a thing people say?) Jacqui versus Fluffy

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Tue, 2015-11-17 19:42
ThisisSakon
ThisisSakon's picture

Herzinth wrote:
They're onto me

Probably because you copied them so much...

Wed, 2015-11-18 19:16
justnobody
Card of the Year 2015
justnobody's picture

Got my comp, setting it up. Will be on Lackey tomorrow, if not today.

Met the devil of card design and sacrificed my creativity for unparalleled templating skill.

Spoiler:

Thu, 2015-11-19 19:37
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

Also, Wind, the list of legal sets in MSE Modern is missing Fires of Valla. You should check that list in the doc.

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Thu, 2015-11-19 20:05
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

I know, it's being fixed in the plug-in

Mon, 2015-11-23 03:11
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

So, Jacqui and I were discussing Struggles of Iscathia and whether it should temporarily be removed from MSE Modern. I can see cutting it for now, but I want to see other peoples' opinions first

Mon, 2015-11-23 17:06
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

That's SoI.

Sun, 2015-11-29 22:16
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

So, we were talking about having a look over a set before adding it to MSE Modern. Has anyone taken a look over Champions of Y'gra? I'm not seeing anything supremely broken but having another look over it would be a good idea.

Sun, 2015-11-29 23:03
Liz the Goddess
Moderator
Liz the Goddess's picture

Don't worry about all the terrible wording issues everyone, Wind and I are currently working on that Stick out your tongue

It IS my first set so it prolly has some issue. I'm definetely not a developer.

I like bears.

Mon, 2015-11-30 00:29
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

You need to rename Unravelling because I renamed Unravel from Time Hop to Unravelling so it wouldn't clash with Lumehaven's Unravel.

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Mon, 2015-11-30 01:11
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

Cards that seem potentially silly:

The Golden Lifeflow scares me. Not sure if it's abusable and even if it is, it's at seven mana.
Nyryn is the scariest Wind Drake I've ever laid eyes upon. I'd like this a lot more at 1 mana symbolWhite mana symbolWhite mana symbol, or 2/1, or both.
Ssishrala's final mode looks really, really good for a one-drop. At White mana symbolWhite mana symbol it'd be like Kytheon's Irregulars (ie, fair).

Gaseous Form shares its name with a canon card. More troubling is that it's Capsize disguised as Pauper bogle tech.
Phase Out is basically Insinuate from Time Hop, except it can also neuter your opponent's spells or something?
Smokeskin Basilisk isn't a basilisk! Come on, d00d.
Urako is worded horribly. I get what it's trying to do-- each creature beyond the first doesn't untap unless its controller pays 1 mana symbol, right? But it's kinda weird and hard to word that.
Yu'thil is a bit weird, and I think he'd see play just as a super Blinking Spirit even without the bounce.

Arnia is on the strong side. Not busted probably but very strong. I don't like that she's so much better than the common Gulbura Vampires despite having the same cost.
Cryptify!! Lol. That's gonna need a rename! Uh. Crypt Curse? Cryptgrooming?
Drain Essence is curious-- it's the one Overcharge card that only targets players.
Glorious Cunning is weak even on a legendary target I think.
Loyal Skeletal Forces should be worded like Reassembling Skeleton
Rotting Corpse is scary! I mean, definitely the best one drop in the set. Not sure why this can't cost 1B.
Unforgiving Ritual isn't Altar's Reap. Why not?

Immolate should get a name change because I can guarantee another set is going to have a burn spell with this name.
Could Risky Fiction cost less? Like, 1 mana symbolRed mana symbolRed mana symbol? Am I crazy?
Slicing Shot is going to read "~ deals 3 damage to two target creatures" for Red mana symbol. Just saying.
Torn Asunder scares the shit out of me. Welcome back to the summer of Sinkhole!!

Blaulther is curious. Is it supposed to have two different P/Ts at level 4?
Eldawnye looks fun in Elves.
Examine the Dream should cost 2 mana symbolGreen mana symbol, right? I hope that's a typo.
Grizzly Bears has no P/T!!! Oh my god!!!
Hid! What a baby!!! What an OP but otherwise fine baby!!!
Overpower is a card that already exists in MSE Modern.

Ninety percent sure Repurpose exists?
Apocalypse Chime but with this set! Yay!!!
Why isn't The Dreamhalls legendary?

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Mon, 2015-11-30 01:34
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

Gaseous Form was name changed to Turn to Gas. Unravelling is now Unravelling Aether. Other cards have been edited

Mon, 2015-11-30 02:40
Liz the Goddess
Moderator
Liz the Goddess's picture

Thanks to Wind's help, a lot of the most egregious errors have been fixed. If any cards prove OP, I can nerf em. For now nothing seems drastically obscene, I suppose. Who knows what kinda format MSE Modern is gonna become.

I like bears.

Mon, 2015-11-30 23:50
isaac the awesome
isaac the awesome's picture

I have a few sets that I think could potentially go into mse modern.
Take a look at my sets
http://magicseteditor.sourceforge.net/node/9214
I think both Ezanavi and Aranog could fit the bill. Let me know if there are any mods i could make

Tue, 2015-12-01 01:19
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

Aranog seems neat. Ezanavi concerns me power level wise for dumb reasons (a shit-ton of cards that read pay 2 life: draw a card mostly) and I'm also worried about confusion when that enters the same standard as Dabriohm.

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Sat, 2015-12-05 18:48
Liz the Goddess
Moderator
Liz the Goddess's picture

Since this is the LackeyCCG as well as the modern thread, I'll put this here: Jacqui, Wind, and myself are planning on doing some draft today. We're thinking Lorwyn, so it uses the regular ol' Magic plugin. If you don't have that and want to join in, send me a PM, or just say hey here. I'll be on Lackey all day, waiting for people. It'd be fun to get some drafting going on every few weeks, trying some weirder formats, and even trying custom formats sometime. Anyone down?

I like bears.

Sat, 2015-12-05 19:49
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

I think my version of the plugin is outdated. Could one of you post the update list?

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Sat, 2015-12-05 19:49
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture
Sat, 2015-12-05 19:50
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

Wait nvm, I just need the password.

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Sat, 2015-12-05 19:57
aquaumisa
aquaumisa's picture

I'm in I guesz

Step: zero to one

Blue/black mana symbol <3 Blue/black mana symbol

Self professed Love Live fan.

Dive into the Planear Ocean and explore whole new worlds!

Sat, 2015-12-05 20:21
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

UPDATE: Wind just cast Enchanted Evening and Fracturing Gust one after the other. Eek.

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Sat, 2015-12-05 21:41
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

Not in the Lorwyn draft. If only

Sat, 2015-12-05 23:22
Liz the Goddess
Moderator
Liz the Goddess's picture

My deck was INSANELY fun. Tri-bal, with Merfolk, Wizards, and Faeries. Mostly merfolk by the end there, but the synergy was freaking amazing. I was gaining like 9 life a turn against aquamisa and I was making armies of 3/3s against Wind in game 2. I got 2nd place though, cause of a really strong elemental card that counters by weenies Stick out your tongue

I like bears.

Sun, 2015-12-06 02:08
aquaumisa
aquaumisa's picture

Pro tip: Never draft Giants in Lorwyn. I did and my deck was a mess. Learn from my mistakes A sad &#039;frowny&#039;

Step: zero to one

Blue/black mana symbol <3 Blue/black mana symbol

Self professed Love Live fan.

Dive into the Planear Ocean and explore whole new worlds!

Fri, 2015-12-11 15:28
Decembra
Decembra's picture

@Herzi: Your deck is honestly quite lost in its ways at the moment. You should definitely be playing the full set of Draconic Mutation because double evasion on a 4/4 for 3cmc without drawbacks is the kind of thing a "grow" deck abuses best. This is assuming you are actually playing a tempo-control style "one creature beatdown" deck.

-Betrayer of Kin is replaced by Goblin Guide if you're in need of a 2/2 Haste. But both options are more suited for straight aggro and aren't the optimal creatures to play the "one creature" game with.

-Wild Cantor is replaced by Ashtimber Elf, though I think a "grow" deck would favor Covetous Squirrel, Artisan Maestro, or Rubypalm Chieftain as a one drop.

-Venerable Sage should either be replaced by a creature that wins the game, or a creature that provides consistent and significant tempo/advantage. It's very difficult to compete with Snapcaster Mage, but there's possibly something much closer to Snapcaster value than the Sage, like Lerinan Archivist or Seer of the New Way. Otherwise, game-winners in the 2cmc slot include some incredible legendaries, namely Sarkhan, Lerisa and Re'eti. Envoy of Zhajrah is solid and Orana Adventurer is worth looking at.

I'll catch you on lackey sometime soon though and we can go through the cards and the angles A happy smile

EDIT: Yes the Ingots should definitely go, maybe even if you do plan to play Artisan Maestro.

Sat, 2015-12-12 09:51
Decembra
Decembra's picture

Ah okay! The counterspells and card filtering threw me off a bit, including Jalenne. Those don't belong in aggro. Soilsilt Ingot should definitely be cut then as well.

I don't know if it's good or terrible, but consider Vehement Exemplar.

Fanatic of Xenagos was reprinted in Time Hop. Might want to test that against Pervasive Aggressor.

Earthcore Elemental is one of the best mid-range cards ever if you find that you don't really want to play true aggro.

Play some "creature or player" burn for removal/reach rather than counterspells.

Sun, 2015-12-13 11:02
Decembra
Decembra's picture

A happy smile I'm definitely not reading it as dismissive, haha. We're both just thinking of the deck and how to iron it out. I'm still not sure whether your deck can afford to be as aggro as it would like to be if those 3-drops require a mana dork to fix your mana to cast them. That almost immediately says "mid-range" to me. Aggro would prefer high combat value 1-drops, 2-drops, 3-drops, etc and wants to cast them consistently without needing non-aggressive mana dorks or card filtering. Aggro actually wants to punish inconsistencies and setup requirements of other decks, that's why I wonder if you're indeed trying to fill out a consistent aggro curve or are you leaning more towards another archetype or a unique aggro with some setup requirements to it.

I'm still against the card draw and counterspells, because Green has things like Diviner Shaman, Biomanipulation, Hunter's Dexterity, Nature's Calling, Hail the Mighty, Tireless Cartographer, Unexpected Harvest, Rapid Fertilization, Vale Deer. Also, some decent lands for this color combination are Warqueen's Abode, Redwater Wellspring, Oran-Rief Grove.

Fri, 2015-12-18 06:26
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

So we haven't forgotten about this! Atog should come out over the weekend and coincide with the release of MTI.

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Fri, 2015-12-18 07:00
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

That's pretty much what I've been waiting on

Fri, 2015-12-18 23:50
aquaumisa
aquaumisa's picture

When the update comes, could you give us a folder of all of the updated sets in MSE Modern? Its annoying to dearch over MSE for the set files

Step: zero to one

Blue/black mana symbol <3 Blue/black mana symbol

Self professed Love Live fan.

Dive into the Planear Ocean and explore whole new worlds!

Sat, 2015-12-19 00:03
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

The doc should have links to all the sets in it. I think it should, anyway.

Worth noting that Stuggles of Iscathia and Hour of Revolution are temporarily being removed from the format while Korakhos overhauls the set. I don't think we're deleting the set (yet anyway), it's just more VEB-block style silliness.

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Sat, 2015-12-19 06:43
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

I'm not fond of the idea of removing sets from the plugin, just from the format. If Homelands can be in the regular Magic plugin, dumb sets can be in this one too

Sat, 2015-12-19 12:08
Guitarweeps
Friendly MSE Designer
Guitarweeps's picture

Well the thing is it causes confusion during deck building and we are probably going to get lots of people putting the cards in their deck because they think they are legal. Like I did...

Check out my updated set hub.

Sat, 2015-12-19 16:24
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

Not that its any better in WoTC formats I'll be fixing the format list so that you can just select MSE Modern and have the all other cards cut out. I'll have that point of information in the update

Sat, 2015-12-19 18:38
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

I wish there was a way to validate your deck for MSE Modern, like there is for draft.

Also, banlist. Have we decided what we're banning and what we're not?

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Sun, 2015-12-20 02:20
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

You know what, ban the whole format

Sun, 2015-12-20 08:04
Liz the Goddess
Moderator
Liz the Goddess's picture

I actually HAVE played against you with it and I don't think that. But I've only played against it once and haven't tested it nearly as extensively as you have.

I like bears.

Sun, 2015-12-20 17:36
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

The Wheel isn't horrible.

I'm most worried about Sylphin Deserter (since it's a "1 mana symbolBlack mana symbolBlack mana symbol: Put an enchantment from your hand onto the battlefield") but I think Wind made it a 2 mana symbolBlack mana symbol 1/3 or something?

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Sun, 2015-12-20 19:11
jacqui-pup
Featured Set Editor - Best Set of 2015 - Community Award
jacqui-pup's picture

Any problems with banning Gilded Armor?

[center]"It's exciting to create something that demonstrates how clever you are, that you pushed in a direction that players didn't anticipate. The problem is that the point of game design isn't to be clever, it's to create a great game." --Mark Rosewater

Sun, 2015-12-20 21:26
Liz the Goddess
Moderator
Liz the Goddess's picture

While a change to Sylphin Deserter saddens me in my Time-Eater deck, it had to happen.

Who's in charge of noticing what's changes and what's not? I assume Wind. Has anyone NOT agreed to changes decided upon/talked about in the other thread? If so, which ones so we can decide what needs to be banned.

I like bears.

Sun, 2015-12-20 23:07
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

I have to know so I can update everything

Mon, 2015-12-21 19:19
Neottolemo
Neottolemo's picture

I haven't played this in a while, but I plan to get back onto it, some of my decks weren't that bad, and they probably won't be hurt that much by the bans.
Now, since you're making the big update with Mercadian Tides (which I downloaded and looks great) and all, I was thinking you could include I Can't Understand Who's Talking in there, too, since I released the set file earlier this month and I think it wouldn't be bad for the format.
Link to Thread

Mon, 2015-12-21 20:04
WindyDelcarlo
Administrator - MSE Add-On Award
WindyDelcarlo's picture

Okay, so the plugin update will be a bit delayed. I need to package all my information and perform a factory reset because we think I've been hacked.